Comments on: Copywrong: How H.R. 5889 “Orphan Works Bill” will Reduce the Rights of Individual Artists http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/ Software Development Topics Thu, 19 Jan 2012 13:36:14 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Melinda Helbock http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2085 Melinda Helbock Tue, 11 Oct 2011 16:10:15 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2085 Is the goal of this bill to encourage theft? I mean seriously, how can anyone think that this is fair in any sense of the word? When someone creates a work of art, there should not be a statute of limitations on how long they can claim it as theirs before someone else comes along and takes it. I have an idea, how about congress focuses less on reducing the rights of artists and more on getting the state of the country in order? Healthcare, a painfully volatile economy, multiple wars, and they are wasting time on this nonsense. Is the goal of this bill to encourage theft? I mean seriously, how can anyone think that this is fair in any sense of the word? When someone creates a work of art, there should not be a statute of limitations on how long they can claim it as theirs before someone else comes along and takes it. I have an idea, how about congress focuses less on reducing the rights of artists and more on getting the state of the country in order? Healthcare, a painfully volatile economy, multiple wars, and they are wasting time on this nonsense.

]]> By: Henderson Injury Attorney http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2084 Henderson Injury Attorney Tue, 30 Aug 2011 21:24:10 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2084 Personally I think that this bill does encourage copyright infringement, and is more counterproductive than anything else. How can Congress pass a bill that basically says "It's ok to steal, just as long as you wait long enough". Who's fault is it if the artist can't be found? Do they deserve to lose the rights to their own original material because someone else wants to use it and can't get in contact with them? None of that makes sense to me, but then again there have been a lot of bills that Congress has passed/considered that do not make sense to me. Personally I think that this bill does encourage copyright infringement, and is more counterproductive than anything else. How can Congress pass a bill that basically says “It’s ok to steal, just as long as you wait long enough”. Who’s fault is it if the artist can’t be found? Do they deserve to lose the rights to their own original material because someone else wants to use it and can’t get in contact with them? None of that makes sense to me, but then again there have been a lot of bills that Congress has passed/considered that do not make sense to me.

]]> By: Hammond and Hammond http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2083 Hammond and Hammond Fri, 10 Dec 2010 21:28:14 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2083 Soo much ambiguity in these bills. Thanks for clarifying a bit, but we should all tread lightly to avoid any unnecessary confrontation. Soo much ambiguity in these bills. Thanks for clarifying a bit, but we should all tread lightly to avoid any unnecessary confrontation.

]]> By: Laura http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2082 Laura Sun, 07 Sep 2008 03:00:37 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2082 I am an artist of sorts. I draw, paint, sculpt, design, write, etc. But I don't really cultivate my talents (as I probably should) nor do I generally post on the web so I don't really feel all that threatened by this bill. However, my daughter has a natural innate talent for drawing, story telling and music. Even when she is not trying, her drawings are fabulous. I don’t say this with bias; it is what I hear from people all the time. Even as a small child, it was recommended by her teachers at school that she be moved to an art based school to help with her talents. We took her out of public school and put her in a Waldorf school. Her talents have grown over the years. She has written several children’s books (including illustrations) that really should be published but finding a publisher that publishes children’s books written and illustrated by a child is a lot easier said than done. She is the one that brought this bill to my attention. She came and told me today that she heard “George W. signed the Orphan Works Bill”. Let me tell you, she is none to happy about it and is making sure everyone who will listen knows it. She has a deviant art account where she and her friends post their works to “share” with others. Now, keeping in mind the fact that I taught her years ago to sign and date everything, no matter how good or bad, and whether she posts it or not. I told her that as an artist, this is very import. Even though she has done this, one of her friends called one day to say that one of her drawings had shown up on someone else’s site and she was not given credit for it. Even though her signature was right there on the picture, they had managed to crop it just enough so you could not tell whose it was. Of course, this particular picture was originally a drawing that she scanned into the computer so they can claim what the want but the proof is on paper. Nowadays, she signs her drawings in a place where there is no way to crop it out. The point of this little story is that some people are rude that way, and can claim they made attempts to find the true artist without ever actually have made any attempt at all. It is my belief that the Orphan Works Bill is just going to make it worse and the true ARTISTS are in danger of losing what little protection they had in the first place. I am an artist of sorts. I draw, paint, sculpt, design, write, etc. But I don’t really cultivate my talents (as I probably should) nor do I generally post on the web so I don’t really feel all that threatened by this bill.

However, my daughter has a natural innate talent for drawing, story telling and music. Even when she is not trying, her drawings are fabulous. I don’t say this with bias; it is what I hear from people all the time. Even as a small child, it was recommended by her teachers at school that she be moved to an art based school to help with her talents. We took her out of public school and put her in a Waldorf school.

Her talents have grown over the years. She has written several children’s books (including illustrations) that really should be published but finding a publisher that publishes children’s books written and illustrated by a child is a lot easier said than done.

She is the one that brought this bill to my attention. She came and told me today that she heard “George W. signed the Orphan Works Bill”. Let me tell you, she is none to happy about it and is making sure everyone who will listen knows it.

She has a deviant art account where she and her friends post their works to “share” with others. Now, keeping in mind the fact that I taught her years ago to sign and date everything, no matter how good or bad, and whether she posts it or not. I told her that as an artist, this is very import.

Even though she has done this, one of her friends called one day to say that one of her drawings had shown up on someone else’s site and she was not given credit for it. Even though her signature was right there on the picture, they had managed to crop it just enough so you could not tell whose it was. Of course, this particular picture was originally a drawing that she scanned into the computer so they can claim what the want but the proof is on paper. Nowadays, she signs her drawings in a place where there is no way to crop it out.

The point of this little story is that some people are rude that way, and can claim they made attempts to find the true artist without ever actually have made any attempt at all. It is my belief that the Orphan Works Bill is just going to make it worse and the true ARTISTS are in danger of losing what little protection they had in the first place.

]]> By: timm http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2081 timm Sun, 20 Jul 2008 14:40:07 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2081 Tomm, good discussion. Currently I am forced to register a work ONLY if I wish to receive protections beyond actual damages. i.e., If someone infringes and I want to sue them, THEN I have to register. And I can register at any time, even after publication. Whereas with the Orphan Works Bill, I have to register everything beforehand to receive any protection. I'm not sure where you came up with the $30 registration fee. The copyright databases described in this bill currently do not exist, and therefore no fee schedule has been set. But we're talking the U.S. government here. Do you really expect they will allow blanket registration for an artist's entire body of work for $30? Name one other government or private registration system that operates this way. Patents, incorporation fees, domain fees, are all pay-per-item. Even the current copyright registration system is $45 PER WORK. The time and money required to register every work I (or any other small-time artist) produces would be prohibitive. Good for mega-corporations and whoever runs the registration systems, bad for the little guy. By limiting damages to fair-use fees, doesn't the Orphan Works bill essentially legalize stealing of all intellectual property? Let's apply this scenario to brick-and-mortar stores. Let's pretend the only penalty for shoplifting at BestBuy is you have to pay the item's fair cost. So if I am skilled enough to steal a DVD from BestBuy, it's free to me. But if I'm caught, then I just have to pay the DVD's original price of $19.99. So why would I even bother to pay for anything? I'd attempt to steal everything I could since there's really no downside to stealing or getting caught, just upside. It is a violation of the "Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works" for any country to impose registration on a rights holder as as a condition of protecting his copyright. The U.S. is also a member country of the "Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property" (The TRIPs Agreement). Article 13 of this copyright-related treaty specifies a Three-Step Test for exceptions to an artist's exclusive right of copyright. The Orphan Works Bill of 2008 violates the Berne Copyright Convention and fails the Three-Step Test of TRIPs. So I have no idea how the government plans to square the Orphan Works Bill with our international obligations on copyrights. As with everything in Washington, follow the money. Who is pushing to fast-track this bill through Congress with little discussion? Google, Getty Images, RIAA... all mega-corporations who can protect their own work but have a strong interest in weakening the protections of the millions of small artists. Tomm, your heart is the right place in that you want to protect the little guy against the greed of the mega-corps. If my assessment is correct, I encourage you to rethink your support for the Orphan Works Bill. Once you dig deeper, I believe you'll see that the Orphan Works Bill is a Trojan Horse to strengthen mega-corporations and reduce the rights of individual artists and publishers. Tomm, good discussion.

Currently I am forced to register a work ONLY if I wish to receive protections beyond actual damages. i.e., If someone infringes and I want to sue them, THEN I have to register. And I can register at any time, even after publication. Whereas with the Orphan Works Bill, I have to register everything beforehand to receive any protection.

I’m not sure where you came up with the $30 registration fee. The copyright databases described in this bill currently do not exist, and therefore no fee schedule has been set. But we’re talking the U.S. government here. Do you really expect they will allow blanket registration for an artist’s entire body of work for $30? Name one other government or private registration system that operates this way. Patents, incorporation fees, domain fees, are all pay-per-item. Even the current copyright registration system is $45 PER WORK. The time and money required to register every work I (or any other small-time artist) produces would be prohibitive. Good for mega-corporations and whoever runs the registration systems, bad for the little guy.

By limiting damages to fair-use fees, doesn’t the Orphan Works bill essentially legalize stealing of all intellectual property? Let’s apply this scenario to brick-and-mortar stores. Let’s pretend the only penalty for shoplifting at BestBuy is you have to pay the item’s fair cost. So if I am skilled enough to steal a DVD from BestBuy, it’s free to me. But if I’m caught, then I just have to pay the DVD’s original price of $19.99. So why would I even bother to pay for anything? I’d attempt to steal everything I could since there’s really no downside to stealing or getting caught, just upside.

It is a violation of the “Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works” for any country to impose registration on a rights holder as as a condition of protecting his copyright. The U.S. is also a member country of the “Agreement on Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property” (The TRIPs Agreement). Article 13 of this copyright-related treaty specifies a Three-Step Test for exceptions to an artist’s exclusive right of copyright. The Orphan Works Bill of 2008 violates the Berne Copyright Convention and fails the Three-Step Test of TRIPs. So I have no idea how the government plans to square the Orphan Works Bill with our international obligations on copyrights.

As with everything in Washington, follow the money. Who is pushing to fast-track this bill through Congress with little discussion? Google, Getty Images, RIAA… all mega-corporations who can protect their own work but have a strong interest in weakening the protections of the millions of small artists.

Tomm, your heart is the right place in that you want to protect the little guy against the greed of the mega-corps. If my assessment is correct, I encourage you to rethink your support for the Orphan Works Bill. Once you dig deeper, I believe you’ll see that the Orphan Works Bill is a Trojan Horse to strengthen mega-corporations and reduce the rights of individual artists and publishers.

]]> By: tomm http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2080 tomm Sat, 19 Jul 2008 20:46:52 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2080 Okay . . . fair enough. However, I am having difficulty understanding your point. As a rightsholder you already ARE forced to register every work in order to receive protections beyond actual damages. Without registration you are NOT entitled to statutory damages, attorney's fees or treble damages. You are ONLY entitled to actual damages so what is your point? What right or protection will the Orphan Act deprive you of that you currently have. That aside, am I to understand that you have a problem with the $30 registration fee? You can always register multiple works in a single catalog for $30. Am I missing something here? Incidentally, my comments were directed at the major publishers and not the "little guys". I happen to be a member of AIMP and have many small publisher friends that I network with and actually like as people. Okay . . . fair enough. However, I am having difficulty understanding your point. As a rightsholder you already ARE forced to register every work in order to receive protections beyond actual damages. Without registration you are NOT entitled to statutory damages, attorney’s fees or treble damages. You are ONLY entitled to actual damages so what is your point? What right or protection will the Orphan Act deprive you of that you currently have.

That aside, am I to understand that you have a problem with the $30 registration fee? You can always register multiple works in a single catalog for $30. Am I missing something here?

Incidentally, my comments were directed at the major publishers and not the “little guys”. I happen to be a member of AIMP and have many small publisher friends that I network with and actually like as people.

]]> By: timm http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2079 timm Sat, 19 Jul 2008 16:32:16 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2079 I don't think the major publishing companies will ever have trouble defending their copyrights. As usual, it's the "little guys" like me who will end up getting screwed by this bill. We simply don't have the time and money to register every blog article we write and photograph we publish with the copyright office. If we are forced to register every work to receive protection, it essentially eliminates copyright protection for everyone EXCEPT the major publishing companies and their hordes of lawyers. Your core argument is basically for the little guy and against the mega-corporation (which I applaud), and yet you've unwittingly done just the opposite. I don’t think the major publishing companies will ever have trouble defending their copyrights. As usual, it’s the “little guys” like me who will end up getting screwed by this bill. We simply don’t have the time and money to register every blog article we write and photograph we publish with the copyright office. If we are forced to register every work to receive protection, it essentially eliminates copyright protection for everyone EXCEPT the major publishing companies and their hordes of lawyers.

Your core argument is basically for the little guy and against the mega-corporation (which I applaud), and yet you’ve unwittingly done just the opposite.

]]> By: tomm http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2078 tomm Sat, 19 Jul 2008 16:19:54 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2078 Another diatribe defending a handful of greedy publishers who have been able to manipulate the law and buy off judges. <snip> The Orphan Act doesn't ELIMINATE damages it merely limits the amount of damages the courts can award a rightsholder in cases where the copyright holder can't be EASILY found. In other words, the rightsholder may only end up collecting the actual damages that was incurred by an infringement (let us not forget that copyright infringement is a "strict liability") which could have been totally avoided in the first place had the rightsholder made their contact information easily accessible to begin with. It's time for copyright law to be changed in such ways as to no longer encourage publishers from using copyright infringement as a profit center. Publishers need to learn how to market their wares in this new economic environment, and until such time as it no longer becomes more profitable to sue than to collect royalties, I'm afraid there will be little incentive for them to do so. <strong>Edited:</strong> No personal attacks, please. We're supposed to be reasonable adults having a mature conversation here. Another diatribe defending a handful of greedy publishers who have been able to manipulate the law and buy off judges.

The Orphan Act doesn’t ELIMINATE damages it merely limits the amount of damages the courts can award a rightsholder in cases where the copyright holder can’t be EASILY found.

In other words, the rightsholder may only end up collecting the actual damages that was incurred by an infringement (let us not forget that copyright infringement is a “strict liability”) which could have been totally avoided in the first place had the rightsholder made their contact information easily accessible to begin with.

It’s time for copyright law to be changed in such ways as to no longer encourage publishers from using copyright infringement as a profit center. Publishers need to learn how to market their wares in this new economic environment, and until such time as it no longer becomes more profitable to sue than to collect royalties, I’m afraid there will be little incentive for them to do so.

Edited: No personal attacks, please. We’re supposed to be reasonable adults having a mature conversation here.

]]> By: timm http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2077 timm Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:05:11 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2077 Learn to share? I think my network of websites with tons of free information demonstrates that I'm more than willing to share. What I don't want to happen is open season on all content, such that anything published automatically becomes public domain available for anyone to use for any purpose without compensation or acknowledgment. If we remove all ownership and profit motive from society, the result is communism, which I think history has shown is a losing proposition. Most people who want "all content to be free" are generally "takers" who take much and give none. Since you believe we should share everything and benefit everyone, would you be willing to open your house and let your neighbors help themselves to your possessions? Learn to share? I think my network of websites with tons of free information demonstrates that I’m more than willing to share. What I don’t want to happen is open season on all content, such that anything published automatically becomes public domain available for anyone to use for any purpose without compensation or acknowledgment.

If we remove all ownership and profit motive from society, the result is communism, which I think history has shown is a losing proposition. Most people who want “all content to be free” are generally “takers” who take much and give none.

Since you believe we should share everything and benefit everyone, would you be willing to open your house and let your neighbors help themselves to your possessions?

]]> By: Getta Life http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2076 Getta Life Tue, 08 Jul 2008 16:43:49 +0000 http://www.devtopics.com/copywrong-how-hr-5889-orphan-works-bill-will-reduce-the-rights-of-individual-artists/#comment-2076 Get a life, learn to share, and copyright will benefit everyone, The intent of copyright is the betterment of society. It wasnt intended to line the pockets of authors as stated by Sandra Day O'coonor. If copyright holders, or should I say publishers :) could see the forest through the trees they would be able to see what's coming. Just a little karma coming down. The congress has no choice but to straighten out the mess caused by the stupidy of the publishers who cost themselves money making relationships and customers.. Get a life, learn to share, and copyright will benefit everyone,
The intent of copyright is the betterment of society. It wasnt intended to line the pockets of authors as stated by Sandra Day O’coonor.
If copyright holders, or should I say publishers :) could see the forest through the trees they would be able to see what’s coming. Just a little karma coming down. The congress has no choice but to straighten out the mess caused by the stupidy of the publishers who cost themselves money making relationships and customers..

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